Shadowdancers

[Xianio]

Why can't you do 5/+6? It's an effect not an item so shouldn't we be able to add that?

+10 magic damage by level 10 is a pretty insane buff. That's a for sure +10 damage a hit. That's significantly better than 2d10 acid.

Why give them immunity to crits though? That doesn't seem to mesh with the classes purpose. If you look at everything an SD gains it's meant for killing casters. I think the 50% to elements is a better option. Basically makes every wiz/sorc need to use death magic/Horrid/Missile storms to kill you. That's very substantial and I'd say definitely worth it. It's been a while since we've seen a very strong wizard killer.

I don't much like the daze on weapon thing. That's insanely powerful. With that you could have someone with +5 weapons and spellcraft ignoring daze effects with DC"s probably around 20. While some may complain about the Daze right now it would be SO much worse if you allowed them such a great weapon buff.

[Daniel]

even tho 10 dmg is better then 2d10 acid by just give the 10 dmg and immune to crits makes it not so bad. and you overestimate the 50% immune any sneak and wait for the dmg sheild to wear off or if they cant they can do what everyone els does to get throught it. the only thing its used for is to reduce the dmg or ice storm. makeing it only look nice. and the immune to crits is because i think it kinda go's haveing shadows all around you should make it hard to hit your good spots. as for makeing them super againt mages how the hell does 2d10 acid dmg make then great against mages. and i didnt say make the dc up to 20 on shadow daze as a wep buff. i would be nice even if it was the dc of the shop and thats 14.

[T3hRedMage]

14 DC is the same as any stunning dagger you'll see in the shops. Getting it for free on any weapon is nice.

Immunity to critical hits with their potential AC and Damage is extremely unbalanced. Clever in a roleplaying sense, but unthinkable in PvP.

[Daniel]

im aware its the same as the shop thats why i said it. and the immune to crits is only time based and not that much time too. its not a perm buff. unless i read rong its supost only last 2 fights or so. so it should not cause a problem. and also the stun for the daggers should not be a perm buff to. you guys are thinking these are all going to last forever. it should all have a time limit to fit it.

[Musekaze]

Daniel they understand that they are not perma buffs. The daze on wep. would prolly be the same duration as maybe divine favor, or at most, one round/level.

but i see the point as giving shadow evade immune to crits, but yes, too overpowered for PvP, thats just too much free stuff (even WITH the EXTREME lack of SDs here)

and SD suits my play style, im just too lazy to make one.

[Daniel]

lack of SD? thats an understatement. they get crap. they have to give up SA dmg that assassins and regular rouges get for noughting great. and what your giveing them is even worse. and if immune to crits is so powerfull then remove it fromt he arti and PMs.

[Daniel]

ok im in need to clear up a few things. first i talked to people and some thought its to strong to have 3 times.... we are talking about summon shaddow as the immune to crits and 10 magic dmg. that is a one time per death thing. after that the complantes about the immune to crits droped. then he said 10 magic dmg to a ranged wep is to good. i agree. perhaps it could be 10 dmg to a melee wep and 5 dmg to a ranged wep.

[A95]

Immunity to crits and +10 damage is just insane.

[Xianio]

2d10 acid damage is the best elemental damage buff in the game. Hell it's the best one on gear too. That stacks with other elemental damage buffs as well. So darkfire+acid+weapon could get you some MASSIVE elemental damage. Yes that can be taken away via buffs/gear but those come with sacrifices and often that means saves (so your daze works) and ac.

Also it only means icestorm if you're dex based. People see SD's and think "Sneaking!" and therefore think they must be dex based to be useful. With the damage buffs they get you couldn't be more wrong. They can hit very very hard with summon shadow up.

I think they're fine as is. Besides what would immunity to crit gain you? For the most part you have low hp and a sneak will just wait you out. I'd prefer a dedicated mage killer to someone who can survive a rogue for a few turns.

[Daniel]

thats dumb, your forceing SD to be str bases. your not suposta acomidate just your build. let me ask you something you gona make a cleric SD? let me see it and ill tell you how well darkfire and acid stack.

[Daniel]

Immunity to crits and +10 damage is just insane.

insane? no bard song is way more powerfull than this and this is a one time deal that doesnt even last as long as one song. you can use bard song a crap load of times. this is not even close to insane.

[A95]

How can you compare immunity to crits to bard song?

You keep going off topic on your suggestions comparing them to classes that are overpowered sometimes.

Immunity to crits means WMs and Sneakers are getting screwed over, and if you can spot/hear the sneak its basically an extra kill for you per death, if you can out damage the WM (which is easy when it cant crit) Your going to get an extra kill per death.

[Daniel]

your out of your mind. SDs have a serous lack of dmg. out dmg a WM my butt. and its not off topic to show there are other things on the server way stronger than immune to crits. even if a wm cant crits for a short period of time they still out dmg a SD. and you cant just say sneaks because there are many sneaks that can still handel killing things that cant be crited. how do you think sneaks kill people with the arti?

[A95]

Most sneaks don't attack the artifact holder, they wait untill a fighter or barbarian or mage does it.

Enough off-topic.

[Daniel]

you need to learn what off topic is. explaning about why SD should get immune to crits is on topic. and there are many sneaks that still kill arti holders. perhaps not your sneaks but good ones yes. i think today i saw little bear kill someone with the arti.